The National Forum   Donate   Your Account   On Line Opinion   Forum   Blogs   Polling   About   
The Forum - On Line Opinion's article discussion area



Syndicate
RSS/XML


RSS 2.0

Main Articles General

Sign In      Register

The Forum > Article Comments > Is Carr's Lakemba Mosque declaration policy on the run? > Comments

Is Carr's Lakemba Mosque declaration policy on the run? : Comments

By David Singer, published 19/8/2013

If Bob Carr's legal advice on West Bank settlement had come from the A-G rather than DFAT it might have been correct.

  1. Pages:
  2. 1
  3. Page 2
  4. 3
  5. All
The Zionists have been lying to Mr Singer again. Carr hasn't stated any new policy. Australia has always, along with the rest of the world, accepted that the creeping annexation of the rest of Palestine is illegal.

The Article 49 to which Mr Singer refers makes the de facto West Bank grab by the Zionists so clearly illegal that even their American handlers recognise this fact though they try to weasel out by the term “illegitimate”. A declaration by a bunch of foreign colonialists at San Remo or an unsuccessful plea to EU by some lawyers to brush Article 49 aside can’t undo Article 49’s clear statement[1] of international law – a statement accepted by every real nation in the world except Costa Rica.

To grease their way out of their criminality the Zionists fall back on legalisms. They quibble about definitions, about “special circumstances” (Jews are special, promised two homelands each, remember), about jurisdiction, about what are really laws and not something else etc. etc., and while I was researching this garbage a very creepy memory was lurking just below the surface. The Holocaust. The Eichmann trial. The disgusting Dr Robert Servatius, his attorney. Read his defence strategy [2] never mind that the offender was guilty as hell – the trial was supposedly illegal, the judge biased, the jurisdiction flawed. Israel not a state when the murders were going on, “it vos orders”. I still remember being aghast at the media reports – how could anybody DARE defile justice like that? And yet seeing the Zionists brazenly defending their defiance[3] of the Geneva Convention[1] to grab more and more of Palestine, one could be reading Servatius all over again.

[1] http://www.icrc.org/ihl/WebART/380-600056 states: “The Occupying Power shall not deport or transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies.”
[2] http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org/trials/eichmanntrial.html
[3] e.g. http://www.commentarymagazine.com/article/the-illegal-settlements-myth/
Posted by EmperorJulian, Thursday, 22 August 2013 12:24:02 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
#Emperor Julian

You make this claim:

"The Zionists have been lying to Mr Singer again. Carr hasn't stated any new policy. Australia has always, along with the rest of the world, accepted that the creeping annexation of the rest of Palestine is illegal."

Please specify when Australia adopted the policy you claim.

Please indicate:

1. Which Australian Government or Governments

2. On what dates

3. A reference to any document setting out the policy you claim that was actually adopted.

Vague, generalised and unsubstantiated statements need to be backed up with solid evidence.

It is my firm belief you have none.
Posted by david singer, Thursday, 22 August 2013 10:29:58 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
To Mr Singer: I am pleased to point out that I am not a lawyer and therefore am more concerned with truth than with legalisms that avoid it (like requiring specifics of which Australian Government adopted what policy and recorded it where, before accepting that illegal actually means illegal). However:

1. Geneva convention four article 49 Clause 6 is part of the Geneva Conventions.

2. Australia ratified the Geneva Conventions in 1958 [1]
http://www.icrc.org/applic/ihl/ihl.nsf/vwTreatiesByCountrySelected.xsp?xp_countrySelected=AU

3. The wording of Article 4(6) specifically proscribes annexing occupied territory for Lebensraum [2].

4. Australian policies are to respect laws which it has ratified (we don't claim to be racially "special").

5. This is why it is Australian policy to accept that the piecemeal annexation of the West Bank is illegal. Failing to proclaim it is not failure to accept and recognise it. Carr referred to it but that doesn't mean any departure from what has always been our policy as a law-abiding country. He should have foreseen that the Zionists, intent on ducking the truth, would latch on to the venue he chose.

All this is so blindingly obvious that it shouldn't have to be spelled out.

[1] http://www.icrc.org/applic/ihl/ihl.nsf/vwTreatiesByCountrySelected.xsp?xp_countrySelected=AU
[2] http://www.icrc.org/ihl/WebART/380-600056 states: “The Occupying Power shall not deport or transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies.”
Posted by EmperorJulian, Thursday, 22 August 2013 2:29:17 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
#To Emperor Julian

As I suspected - a load of codswallop. Your version of "truth" has nothing to do with your claim that "Australia has always, along with the rest of the world, accepted that the creeping annexation of the rest of Palestine is illegal."

Even Carr did not go that far when he tried to ambush Rudd and the current Government into embracing a policy that denied Jews had the legal right to live in the West Bank.

Rudd has been strangely silent so far.

Maybe he has become completely tongue tied at Carr's slick way of "pulling the rabbit out of the hat" - in failing to immediately disavow or confirm Carr's Lakemba Mosque Declaration.

Gosh - why is Rudd taking so long to tell the voters - "The Minister's declaration accurately reflects my view and Labor Party policy which was adopted on [ ]" or conversely - "the views expressed by the Minister on the steps of the Lakemba Mosque were his own personal views and neither I nor the Labor Party has yet endorsed his remarks as representing Labor Party policy."

Rudd needs to come clean - and very soon.
Posted by david singer, Thursday, 22 August 2013 3:59:04 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Mr Singer, read these words slowly, one at a time. After each word pause and think about what it means.

"The Occupying Power shall not deport or transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies"

Then think about the whole sentence means. It's not codswallop. The whole world has signed up to it. Even - in 1951 - by the settlers who assume they're above having to conform to international law because they think they're God's chosen. Carr was foolish to express a belief that the Zionist enclave deserved to exist, and impolitic to choose a mosque in which to say Australia agreed with the rest of the world about the enclave's illegal expansion, but if taking a stand for law already taken by the rest of the world becomes an election issue it will start a public debate that needs to be had.
Posted by EmperorJulian, Thursday, 22 August 2013 6:15:09 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
#Emperor Julian

You continue to fail to provide any evidence to support your following claim:

"Australia has always, along with the rest of the world, accepted that the creeping annexation of the rest of Palestine is illegal."

If you want to have another try at attempting the impossible - please feel free to do so.

Now you add:

"Carr was foolish to express a belief that the Zionist enclave deserved to exist,"

Why was Carr foolish to do so?
Posted by david singer, Friday, 23 August 2013 2:03:25 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
  1. Pages:
  2. 1
  3. Page 2
  4. 3
  5. All

About Us :: Search :: Discuss :: Feedback :: Legals :: Privacy