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The Forum > Article Comments > Embracing Life > Comments

Embracing Life : Comments

By George Seymour, published 11/3/2010

An ethical mind takes seriously the question of the assertion of their will over the lives of others, including animals.

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Absolutely, Antiseptic.

>>My dog Max is no captive. He doesn't even have a collar and has no fences keeping him from roaming. He travels everywhere with me of his own volition. If I have to leave him home, he is not happy. He'd do just fine if he was to go bush, but he doesn't want to<<

I have long reconciled myself to the fact that my concerns about dogs being kept as playthings for their human owners are well accepted by most dog-owners.

Except of course that it doesn't apply to their own particular Rover or Fido, who couldn't be happier.

Give him a biscuit from me, won't you.
Posted by Pericles, Friday, 12 March 2010 4:18:17 PM
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I may be a bit more primitive than most.

I have caught & hunted my for my food, many times. As a kid I took rabbits for food, & their skins. I have raised cattle for food, also. That doesn't stop you loving them.

My old shotgun has produced something to eat for every shot. Yes I did miss a couple of times, but as I got older, rather than climbing, I would shoot hands of coconuts out of the palm. It may take 4 shots to fell a hand of 10 nuts, so you catch up for misses.

Animals can be very happy living with us. My stalion is over 20, & has been with us since he was 4 months old, when he came with his mother. We raised him, "broke" & trained him, & my daughter & I show jumped him for years.

He won many events, because he jumped beautifully. He did that because he trusted us not to ask him for anything he couldn't do. He is enjoying his retirement, but comes, often at the trot, when he sees us comming. He even has different calls for me, or her.

Another of my old horses hated retirement. He became miserable when we stopped riding him regularly, & stood at the paddock gate all day, looking up to the house. I invited one of the local pony club kids, to compete with him. When she started training him 3 or 4 days a week, he stopped his lonely vigil at the gate.

Even a couple of years later, when he was ready to retire, he had to live up near the house, get a lot of attention, & a ride from time to time.

I am quite sure our animals have had a better life with us, than they would have had, in the wild.
Posted by Hasbeen, Friday, 12 March 2010 6:06:30 PM
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Pericles, it has been proven again and again that people who own and love pets and animals are:
less likely to have high blood pressure,
less likely to suffer from a mental illness,
far less likely to be admitted to hospital,
and, most importantly, less likely to assault or murder humans!

Doesn't look good for you does it? :)
Posted by suzeonline, Friday, 12 March 2010 10:33:38 PM
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My daughter when aged 8yrs purchased a goldfish named Whisky.
As I had only ever caught fish humanely and returned them to the sea; never bonded with any.
Whisky was 5yrs old on the day my daughter turned 13 attending a school excursion interstate and asked the family to feed Whisky during her absence.

Over the years I noticed Whisky occasionally retreating to the bottom of the tank when an altercation or argument erupted in the household. When the arguments had ceased; Whisky would rise to the top and stare at everyone in the loungeroom blowing bubbles. When peace reigned Whisky would not blow bubbles for weeks nor zoom to the bottom of his tank.

I fed Whisky his normal pinch while my daughter was away, chatted to him and gave attention as my daughter had over the years that week.

On the day of my daughter's birthday on her excursion Whisky died aged 5yrs.

I chatted to a pet shop owner months later about it and her reply was that goldfish definitely comprehend more than what people give them credit for. She has interacted with many over her 20year pet shop career and said it is sad that people just assume goldfish or any fish do not feel emotions or pain
Posted by we are unique, Sunday, 14 March 2010 10:44:06 PM
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Interesting line of reasoning, suzeonline.

>>Pericles, it has been proven again and again that people who own and love pets and animals are: less likely to have high blood pressure, less likely to suffer from a mental illness, far less likely to be admitted to hospital, and, most importantly, less likely to assault or murder humans! Doesn't look good for you does it? :)<<

Couple of points.

This would seem to support my point that we humans are exploiting animals to our own advantage, would it not? The benefits are all on our side, none on theirs.

And if your intention was to show concern for me personally, as in my life - or the lives of those around me - might be in danger, have no fear.

My views on the topic are entirely grounded in my love for animals. I'm entirely unconvinced that the act of ownership confers any particular added virtue, health benefit or longevity.

On the topic of longevity, it seems to me particularly selfish of elderly people to keep dogs in captivity, and in doing so deprive them of exercise and fresh air, bar the odd toddle to the shops and back.

Just saying.
Posted by Pericles, Monday, 15 March 2010 8:10:01 AM
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Pericles:"The benefits are all on our side, none on theirs."

Hardly. My dog's, of which there have been 10 over the years have been keopt free of vermin, well fed, rarely been restrained and have had a varied and stimulating lifestyle. Domestic dogs, on the whole live much longer than their wild counterparts and do so much less stressfully for all of their extended span.

I expect Max to live to perhaps 15 or 16, while a wild dog or wolf will last to perhaps 5 or 6, the last couple usually constantly hungry as they lose status within their pack. I doubt that the relative extension of my life would come close, assuming suze is right.

Pericles:"t seems to me particularly selfish of elderly people to keep dogs in captivity, and in doing so deprive them of exercise and fresh air, bar the odd toddle to the shops and back."

Circumstances alter cases. I do take your point about the elderly, but very often the dog in question is also elderly and has been a companion for years. Two old creatures gently decaying together doesn't sound so bad, does it?

I expect Max to go when I'm around the mid-60s. I'll very probably have acquired another dog in the couple of preceding years, which will be my last. I'm sure the grandkids will love playing with it and it with them.
Posted by Antiseptic, Monday, 15 March 2010 8:38:02 AM
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